On 13 May 2016, at 12:22, Hans Hagen wrote:

in principle one can make ∫ and \int but that has other side effects

What side effect do you have in mind here?

On 13 May 2016, at 13:35, Hans Hagen wrote:

On 5/13/2016 1:07 PM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

...

On 13 May 2016, at 12:22, Hans Hagen wrote:

in principle one can make ∫ and \int but that has other side effects

What side effect do you have in mind here?

using it as normal character .. it's often harder to turn off features than to turn on

and making all those characters active by default is not a good idea

The use in the source code helps readability of math formulas, though.

On 13 May 2016, at 14:08, Hans Hagen wrote:

On 5/13/2016 1:55 PM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

...

On 13 May 2016, at 13:35, Hans Hagen wrote:

On 5/13/2016 1:07 PM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

...

On 13 May 2016, at 12:22, Hans Hagen wrote:

in principle one can make∫and \int but that has other side effects

What side effect do you have in mind here?

using it as normal character .. it's often harder to turn off features than to turn on

and making all those characters active by default is not a good idea

The use in the source code helps readability of math formulas, though.

it's no problem to make a module that supports that but it will never be default (some \mathcommand's represent base characters then become larger for instance while the corresponding base character is fixed in size), so ∫ by default is the character and not the 'adapting construct' (tex often has many commands for the same symbol doing different things)

Currently, there is a problem with the lack of efficient Unicode input methods: symbol table and copy-paste are slow. But perhaps in the future, more might want to use it. There may not be so many symbols: the “large operators" in the Tex Book, p. 435, though Unicode have more, and some others like √ U+221A for \sqrt. I could not make your code working - does it require a later LuaTex version (than 0.80.0)?

On 05/13/2016 04:25 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

I am currently writing in French some ConTeXt documentation. That's why I'm looking for some help about coding footnotes within a 'critical apparatus' work, like the sample given here below (which is given by Maieul Rouquette through its release of reledmac's LaTeX macro). Let me know, please, some documentation resources on this topic.

My question is as follow : how can ConTeXt produce the same printing as the one given by LaTeX ? I am not looking for a very translation in ConTeXt of this file given in LaTeX ! A similar sample (where different levels of notes are managed as in this LaTeX file) will be perfect.

Hi Jean-Pierre, here you have a basic sample: \mainlanguage[la] \setuplayout[header=0cm, footer=0cm] \setuplinenumbering[step=5] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupbodyfont[palatino, 7.8pt] \starttext \start\en \startlinenumbering \dorecurse{9}% only to repeat the following paragraph {Cum defensionum \CNote{laboribus}{first note} senatoriisque muneribus aut omnino aut magna ex parte essem aliquando liberatus, rettuli me, Brute, te hortante maxime ad ea studia, quae retenta animo, remissa temporibus, longo intervallo intermissa revocavi, et cum omnium artium, quae ad rectam vivendi viam pertinerent, \ANote{ratio}{second note} et disciplina studio sapientiae, quae philosophia dicitur, contineretur, hoc mihi Latinis litteris \DNote{inlustrandum}{third note} putavi, non quia \BNote{philosophia}{fourth note} Graecis et litteris et doctoribus percipi non posset, sed meum semper iudicium fuit omnia nostros aut invenisse per se sapientius quam Graecos aut accepta ab illis fecisse meliora, quae quidem digna statuissent, in quibus elaborarent.\par} \stoplinenumbering \stoptext I hope it helps, Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk

Hi Pablo ! Now, with the same scheme you generously gave us, I try to print (as a sample) some Ancient Greek text on a column located at left, with its Latin translation located on the right of the page and 'criticus apparatus' in French the footnotes, as previously asked. Then, we have Greek, Latin and French languages... Thank you very much for your help ! JP A sample of Aristotle Greek: [1a] Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον• τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος• ἐὰν γὰρ ↵ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει. Latin translation: Aequivoca dicuntur quorum nomen solum commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa, ut animal homo et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem. ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Samedi 14 Mai 2016 19:16:45 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/13/2016 04:25 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

I am currently writing in French some ConTeXt documentation. That's why I'm looking for some help about coding footnotes within a 'critical apparatus' work, like the sample given here below (which is given by Maieul Rouquette through its release of reledmac's LaTeX macro). Let me know, please, some documentation resources on this topic.

My question is as follow : how can ConTeXt produce the same printing as the one given by LaTeX ? I am not looking for a very translation in ConTeXt of this file given in LaTeX ! A similar sample (where different levels of notes are managed as in this LaTeX file) will be perfect.

Hi Jean-Pierre, here you have a basic sample: \mainlanguage[la] \setuplayout[header=0cm, footer=0cm] \setuplinenumbering[step=5] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupbodyfont[palatino, 7.8pt] \starttext \start\en \startlinenumbering \dorecurse{9}% only to repeat the following paragraph {Cum defensionum \CNote{laboribus}{first note} senatoriisque muneribus aut omnino aut magna ex parte essem aliquando liberatus, rettuli me, Brute, te hortante maxime ad ea studia, quae retenta animo, remissa temporibus, longo intervallo intermissa revocavi, et cum omnium artium, quae ad rectam vivendi viam pertinerent, \ANote{ratio}{second note} et disciplina studio sapientiae, quae philosophia dicitur, contineretur, hoc mihi Latinis litteris \DNote{inlustrandum}{third note} putavi, non quia \BNote{philosophia}{fourth note} Graecis et litteris et doctoribus percipi non posset, sed meum semper iudicium fuit omnia nostros aut invenisse per se sapientius quam Graecos aut accepta ab illis fecisse meliora, quae quidem digna statuissent, in quibus elaborarent.\par} \stoplinenumbering \stoptext I hope it helps, Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Pablo and other ConTeXt wizards ! I've tried to find a solution to my previous question. Thanks to Pablo Rodriguez, the script is working very well. But when I try to take his solution with a 2 columns scheme (a Greek tex on left and a latin one on right), the footnotes are not printed. I did something which is not the best : to gather some declarations and see if they work ! Then, the script below is more or less working (it does work : no error in the log !), but because it doesn't print footnotes, I wonder that it succeeds to print the 2 columns (greek and latin) ! To summarize what it doesn't work here : 1) lines numbering 2) footnotes Here is the script, which need to be clarified. % \usemodule[simplefonts] \definefontfamily [mainface] [serif] [Palatino] \mainlanguage[gr] % Greek as main language \setuplayout[header=2cm, footer=2cm] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupalign[hz, hanging] \setuptolerance[strict] \defineparagraphs[TwoColumns][n=2, align={hz, hanging}] \setupparagraphs[TwoColumns][1][width=200pt, style=regular, align=left] \setuplinenumbering[step=5] \setupbodyfont[palatino, 7.8pt] \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \startlinenumbering \startTwoColumns \dorecurse{4}{[1a] Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον· τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος· ἐὰν γὰρ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει.\par}\TwoColumns \dorecurse{4}{Aequivoca dicuntur quorum nomen\CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae\ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} ratio\ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal homo\DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem.\par} \stopTwoColumns \stoplinenumbering \stoptext ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Dimanche 15 Mai 2016 17:07:06 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/15/2016 04:35 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo !

Now, with the same scheme you generously gave us, I try to print (as a sample) some Ancient Greek text on a column located at left, with its Latin translation located on the right of the page and 'criticus apparatus' in French the footnotes, as previously asked. Then, we have Greek, Latin and French languages...

Hi Jean-Pierre, I’m afraid that parallel texts is something it has to be improved in ConTeXt, when Hans finds the time, the motivation... and a more or less unified proposal. So, you will have to wait until it is implemented (or simply improved). Pablo

A sample of Aristotle Greek: [1a] Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον· τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος· ἐὰν γὰρ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει.

Latin translation: Aequivoca dicuntur quorum nomen solum commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa, ut animal homo et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem.

-- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

On 5/15/2016 8:36 PM, Pablo Rodriguez wrote:

I know Hans will hate me ;-), but the fun comes when the recursion exceeds the first page.

don't worry, as i don't follow this thread too closely in fact, pages-001 is a test for parallel texts (but there is a one line offset that i need to fix) Thomas is in charge of the parallel text spec and he's too busy to follow up on that so I patiently wait for him to pick up that thread, Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Pablo, 1. My code is a raw one, with some old pieces; I know simplefonts module is in the core since 2013, but it's a kind of pavlovian attitude... 2. Many thanks for 'agr' which I'm looking for through CTX doc and never found. 3. I understand why I have to load either 'agr' ith 'la' pattern. 4. I've to improve my understanding of \setmainfont, \definefontfamily and \definefallbackfamily and their declaration order. In this particulary case, why don't use something like this declaration : \setmainfontfallback[DejaVu Serif][range={greekandcoptic, greekextended},force=yes, rscale=auto] ? 5. Is it possible to find information about CTXt fonts apart of the system ones with a mtxrun command ? Thank you for your code, which I am studying and testing right now. JP ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Dimanche 15 Mai 2016 20:36:47 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/15/2016 06:46 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo and other ConTeXt wizards !

I've tried to find a solution to my previous question. Thanks to Pablo Rodriguez, the script is working very well. But when I try to take his solution with a 2 columns scheme (a Greek tex on left and a Latin one on right), the footnotes are not printed. I did something which is not thebest : to gather some declarations and see if they work ! Then, the script below is more or less working (it does work : no error in the log !), but because it doesn't print footnotes, I wonder that it succeeds to print the 2 columns (greek and latin) ! To summarize what it doesn't work here : 1) lines numbering 2) footnotes

Hi Jean-Pierre, some remarks about your code: 1. The simplefonts module isn’t needed anymore. The code has been added to the ConTeXt core. 2. The language code for ancient Greek is agr. 3. In this particular case, you may load the Latin patterns with the Greek language. 4. You define a mainface using the Palatino typeface, but then you load palatino. It only works when you load the mainface. 5. It is better when you use typefaces distributed with ConTeXt. Well, my code doesn’t work well. Line numbers and notes are only allowed on one column. I know Hans will hate me ;-), but the fun comes when the recursion exceeds the first page. BTW, I guess this approach (as flawed as it is) should work, but I should be missing something with columns. It is beyond my understanding why the last Greek paragraph fits on the first page and the lat Latin paragraph doesn’t fit. Here is the code: \setuplanguage[agr][patterns={agr, la}] \mainlanguage[agr] % Greek as main language \definefallbackfamily [mainface] [serif] [GFS Didot] [preset=range:greek] \definefontfamily [mainface] [serif] [TeX Gyre Pagella] \setuplayout[header=2cm, footer=2cm] \setupnotes[compress=yes] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupalign[hz, hanging] \setuptolerance[strict] \setuplinenumbering[step=5, location=inright, distance=1ex, align=center, width=0.5em] \definemargindata[Stephanus][location=inner, distance=2ex, style=\em] \setupbodyfont[mainface, 7.8pt] \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \stop \dorecurse{5}{\startcolumns[n=2, balance=yes] \Stephanus{1a} Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον· τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος· ἐὰν γὰρ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει. \column \startlinenumbering[continue] Aequivoca dicuntur quorum \CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero \ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} \ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal \DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem. \stoplinenumbering \stopcolumns} \stoptext Just in case it might help, Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Luigi, Thanks for the mtxrun command. JP ----- Mail original ----- De: "luigi scarso" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Lundi 16 Mai 2016 09:36:24 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 9:25 AM, Jean-Pierre Delange < adeimantos@free.fr > wrote: Hi Pablo, 1. My code is a raw one, with some old pieces; I know simplefonts module is in the core since 2013, but it's a kind of pavlovian attitude... 2. Many thanks for 'agr' which I'm looking for through CTX doc and never found. 3. I understand why I have to load either 'agr' ith 'la' pattern. You may also consider ala lang-ala.rme: % generated by mtxrun --script pattern --convert % % ********** hyph-la-x-classic.tex ************* % % Copyright 2014 Claudio Beccari % [classical latin hyphenation patterns] % % ----------------------------------------------------------------- % IMPORTANT NOTICE: % % This program can be redistributed and/or modified under the terms % of the LaTeX Project Public License Distributed from CTAN % archives in directory macros/latex/base/lppl.txt; either % version 1 of the License, or any later version. % ----------------------------------------------------------------- % % Patterns for the classical Latin language; classical spelling % with the (uncial) lowercase `v' written as a `u' is supported. % Classical Latin hyphenation patterns are different from those of % "plain" Latin, the latter being more adapted to modern Latin. % % % Prepared by Claudio Beccari % e-mail claudio dot beccari at gmail dot com % % Aknowledgements: This file has been substantially upgraded with % the contributions of Francisco Gracia. % % \versionnumber{1.2} \versiondate{2014/10/06} % %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% % % \message{Classical Latin hyphenation patterns `hyph-la-x-classic' % Version 1.2 <2014/10/06>} % % -- luigi ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 11:44 AM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Luigi,

How can I manage 'ala' or 'agr' through mtxrun ? Thanks, JP

Not sure to understand your question...what do you mean with "manage" ? Afaik \mainlanguage[ala] should already work . -- luigi

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 12:02 PM, Pablo Rodriguez wrote:

On 05/16/2016 11:52 AM, luigi scarso wrote:

...

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 11:44 AM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Luigi,

How can I manage 'ala' or 'agr' through mtxrun ? Thanks, JP

Not sure to understand your question...what do you mean with "manage" ? Afaik \mainlanguage[ala] should already work .

But aren’t \la and \ala synonyms?

hm no

Besides that, Latin has always been an ancient language, hasn’t it?

yes but still used https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lingua_latina see the ATM with Contemporary Latin (I dont know if Contemporary is the correct term). It's the official language of the Holy See (the official language of Vatican is italian & latin)

-- luigi

But does ConTeXt have \la different from \ala because of the Holy See?

See my reply to your earlier email. Arthur

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:06 PM, Pablo Rodriguez wrote:

On 05/16/2016 03:14 PM, Arthur Reutenauer wrote:

...

...

But does ConTeXt have \la different from \ala because of the Holy See?

See my reply to your earlier email.

I agree with you that classical or ancient vs. modern are misleading adjectives when referred to Latin.

no so strange https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin#History_of_Latin https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecclesiastical_Latin -- luigi

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:24 PM, Arthur Reutenauer < arthur.reutenauer@normalesup.org> wrote:

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 06:06:49PM +0200, Pablo Rodriguez wrote:

...

On 05/16/2016 03:14 PM, Arthur Reutenauer wrote:

...

...

But does ConTeXt have \la different from \ala because of the Holy See?

See my reply to your earlier email.

I agree with you that classical or ancient vs. modern are misleading adjectives when referred to Latin.

In my opinion, etymological or phonetic vs. syllabic should be preferred.

There are two layers, actually (at least in LaTeX; not sure how much of this is reproduced in ConTeXt): 1. Spelling conventions, 2. Hyphenation. For the latter, a classification by historical periods clearly makes no sense, but there is some truth to the fact that an orthography with no u/v or i/j distinction is closer to the way Latin was written in classical times (if only very slightly); while using both u and v, and especially i and j, in contrastive distributions, clearly are modern conventions -- it would be nice to have a vocabulary for that that doesn't rely on periods of the evolution of Latin, since those cover much more than simple differences in spelling. The LaTeX packages (Babel and Polyglossia) currently have four options, actually: classical, medieval, modern, and liturgical, such that "classical" will for example yield "Nouembris" (and all the other ones "Novembris"); "medieval" uses æ and œ and will thus have "Præfatio", etc.

Best,

Arthur

liturgical latin uses œ́ from 1894 (Missale romanum: en decreto sacrosancti Concilii Tridentini restitutum. https://archive.org/details/missaleromanume01churgoog) It seems the first time it appears. -- luigi

On Mon, May 16, 2016 at 6:50 PM, Arthur Reutenauer < arthur.reutenauer@normalesup.org> wrote:

...

liturgical latin uses œ́ from 1894 (Missale romanum: en decreto sacrosancti Concilii Tridentini restitutum. https://archive.org/details/missaleromanume01churgoog) It seems the first time it appears.

Yes, that's one of the conventions they have for liturgical Latin.

do you know others ? -- luigi

On 5/16/2016 3:13 PM, Arthur Reutenauer wrote:

to; in addition I think that even calling the language variants modern and classical is a bit of a joke when in actuality they only differ by a

indeed .. try to explain that to kids, what is modern to day is classical (or ancient) tomorrow Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

I understand that the world of Latin studies regarding printing Latin becomes more and more a sum of parochial conflicts, which lay on specialization (because, as you know, there are some differences between Republican Latin, Imperial Latin, Latin written by Sidonius Apollinaris, by Petrus Abelardi, Renatus Cartesianus et alii. Have you heard about the same pichrocholine wars around Greek ?

There is no conflict, simply different options for typesetting Latin (in LaTeX) that are not necessarily very well described. The development of all the different variants is carried out by the same group of people, or rather one single, very dedicated person. There is no similar situation for Greek that I'm aware of. Best, Arthur

On 05/16/2016 10:58 AM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo, I have first running your code here below and it is working fine, generally speaking. But there are some problems I need to clarify:

Hi Jean-Pierre, I assume you are running the same version as the one included in https://mailman.ntg.nl/pipermail/ntg-context/2016/085521.html (only recursion may be set to a higher number), aren’t you? I include at the end of the message to be sure we share the same sources.

a. Beside the fact that I am running today on Windows and there is not GFS Didot typeface on the sytem (therefore I use TeX Gyre), there is a lack of Greek diacritic signs in the Greek print.

Isn’t it possible that you install GFS Didot on that Windows system?

b. I don't see the footnotes references (but only the footnotes).

I’m not sure I get your point. These are linenotes, not footnotes. References are to the line number, not to a footnote number. Is that what you meant?

c. the log file gives something weird about {\startcolumns[n=2, balance=yes]

It seems to have problems to balance the columns. But the file below doesn’t gave me that message. I hope it helps, Pablo \setuplanguage[agr][patterns={agr, la}] \mainlanguage[agr] % Greek as main language \definefallbackfamily [mainface] [serif] [GFS Didot] [preset=range:greek] \definefontfamily [mainface] [serif] [TeX Gyre Pagella] \setuplayout[header=2cm, footer=2cm] \setupnotes[compress=yes] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupalign[hz, hanging] \setuptolerance[strict] \setuplinenumbering[step=5, location=inright, distance=1ex, align=center, width=0.5em] \definemargindata[Stephanus][location=inner, distance=2ex, style=\em] \setupbodyfont[mainface, 7.8pt] \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \stop \dorecurse{50}{\startcolumns[n=2, balance=yes] \Stephanus{1a} Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον· τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος· ἐὰν γὰρ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει. \column \startlinenumbering[continue] Aequivoca dicuntur quorum \CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero \ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} \ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal \DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem. \stoplinenumbering \stopcolumns} \stoptext -- http://www.ousia.tk

Hi Pablo, 1. Here is my current version on Linux : ConTeXt ver: 2016.05.15 20:46 MKIV beta fmt: 2016.5.16 (and the same on Windows). 2. I've tried to install GFS Didot on Windows, but I did'nt find TTF... And when I copy files in c:/windows/fonts, ce system complains. How do you do that ? 3. We use both the same source file. 4. I was dummy : I was not aware of the mean of \definelinenote ! 5. Note that here, the \dorecurse{50} command seems to produce an unexpected effect : the latin text takes place of the greek one with its lines numbers (I really don't know if the \dorecurse commande is (Something out of the topic : under Linux, when I load GFS Didot, after reloading fonts (with mtxrun --script fonts --reload), I don't see the GFS fonts, with the command mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=didot* --all. Strange, isn't it ?) As attached files, the TeX source, the log file and the PDF print. Many thanks for your help ! JP À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Lundi 16 Mai 2016 11:42:35 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/16/2016 10:58 AM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo, I have first running your code here below and it is working fine, generally speaking. But there are some problems I need to clarify:

Hi Jean-Pierre, I assume you are running the same version as the one included in https://mailman.ntg.nl/pipermail/ntg-context/2016/085521.html (only recursion may be set to a higher number), aren’t you? I include at the end of the message to be sure we share the same sources.

a. Beside the fact that I am running today on Windows and there is not GFS Didot typeface on the sytem (therefore I use TeX Gyre), there is a lack of Greek diacritic signs in the Greek print.

Isn’t it possible that you install GFS Didot on that Windows system?

b. I don't see the footnotes references (but only the footnotes).

I’m not sure I get your point. These are linenotes, not footnotes. References are to the line number, not to a footnote number. Is that what you meant?

c. the log file gives something weird about {\startcolumns[n=2, balance=yes]

It seems to have problems to balance the columns. But the file below doesn’t gave me that message. I hope it helps, Pablo \setuplanguage[agr][patterns={agr, la}] \mainlanguage[agr] % Greek as main language \definefallbackfamily [mainface] [serif] [GFS Didot] [preset=range:greek] \definefontfamily [mainface] [serif] [TeX Gyre Pagella] \setuplayout[header=2cm, footer=2cm] \setupnotes[compress=yes] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupalign[hz, hanging] \setuptolerance[strict] \setuplinenumbering[step=5, location=inright, distance=1ex, align=center, width=0.5em] \definemargindata[Stephanus][location=inner, distance=2ex, style=\em] \setupbodyfont[mainface, 7.8pt] \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \stop \dorecurse{50}{\startcolumns[n=2, balance=yes] \Stephanus{1a} Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον· τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος· ἐὰν γὰρ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει. \column \startlinenumbering[continue] Aequivoca dicuntur quorum \CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero \ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} \ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal \DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem. \stoplinenumbering \stopcolumns} \stoptext -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Pablo, Return back to windows 10 environment ... 1. The commands 'mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=*didot* --all' works fine ... So, the question is : If GFS Didot is installed on the system, why ConTeXt complains about it during the parsing process ? 2. I was not very convinced by the \doreverse command involving in the 2 columns balance issue, but I don't understand why the last paragraph at the end of the page is removed from right to left on every page (try to give the 50 number to the \dorecurse command and you xill see the same issue on each page). JP ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Lundi 16 Mai 2016 14:09:15 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/16/2016 01:12 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo,

2. I've tried to install GFS Didot on Windows, but I did'nt find TTF... And when I copy files in c:/windows/fonts, ce system complains. How do you do that ?

http://greekfontsociety.gr/_assets/fonts/GFS_Didot.zip contains both TTF and OTF files. How about showing file extensions to select the files you want? (http://www.thewindowsclub.com/show-file-extensions-in-windows)

5. Note that here, the \dorecurse{50} command seems to produce an unexpected effect : the latin text takes place of the greek one with its lines numbers (I really don't know if the \dorecurse commande is

I don’t think this is caused by \dorecurse. But column balance seems to be a tricky issue.

(Something out of the topic : under Linux, when I load GFS Didot, after reloading fonts (with mtxrun --script fonts --reload), I don't see the GFS fonts, with the command mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=didot* --all. Strange, isn't it ?)

How about the following? (Your command works fine for me) mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=*didot* --all Just in case it helps, Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Lundi 16 Mai 2016 18:00:41 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/16/2016 05:00 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo,

Return back to windows 10 environment ... 1. The commands 'mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=*didot* --all' works fine ... So, the question is : If GFS Didot is installed on the system, why ConTeXt complains about it during the parsing process ?

...

I have no idea. I don’t read logs most of the times.

...

To quote Shakespeare: “all’s well, that ends well”.

2. I was not very convinced by the \doreverse command involving in the 2 columns balance issue, but I don't understand why the last paragraph at the end of the page is removed from right to left on every page (try to give the 50 number to the \dorecurse command and you xill see the same issue on each page).

...

\doreverse? I guess it is \dorecurse.

yes, I've made a misespelling. I's \dorecurse

...

What happens with the column balance can be explained by Hans.

It seems to be related to the linenotes on the right.

I addressed the issue in a separate thread (https://mailman.ntg.nl/pipermail/ntg-context/2016/085544.html), but Hans may be busy with other things.

\dorecurse only avoids copying the same text again and again.

I dont know how to manage Hans proposal : I've tried to deal with it and the visible effect is to place footnotes in the column on the right. Maye I'll have to test with a longer text without the \dorecurse command ... JP

...

Just in case it helps,

...

Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk

If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Pablo and greek-latin readers (and printers), I've given a look further into the documentation about the modules 'newcolumnset', in order to understand this issue, where ConTeXt put the latin paragraph in the continuity of greek paragraph, when one tries to get 2 paragraphs in 2 face to face columns in 2 different languages (with the goal to print a 'criticus apparatus' in a few different level of footnotes). Wolfgang Schuster stimulated me about the new documentation ! Then, I have found, in the doc produced by : context --extra=setups --overview i-columns.xml, this intersting information (cf. last line) : quotation : "This manual introduces column sets, one of the output routines of ConTEXt. Although column sets are mainly meant for typesetting journals in a semi--automated way, you can also use them for books. We assume that the user is familiar with ConTEXt and only discuss the commands that are related to column sets. This mechanism performs okay but it needs to be used with care: an occasional manual intervention is needed to get optimal results. After all, we’re operating in the area where normally click and point desktop publishing is used. For the moment you need to load the new code with: \usemodule[newcolumnsets]". Allright ! Then, I have listening this advice and there is the new code (on the basis of Pablo's work); I've only added declarations lines as \usemodule[newcolumnsets], and \definecolumnset[example][n=2, balance=yes]. The result is almost satisfying, because 'criticus apparatus' is well printed in footnotes, the numbering lines okay and the first 2 texts (greek and latin paragraphs) quite well printed in two face to face columns. BUT, I don't understand why after a good print, all is messed up. Is it because the closing bracket after \dorecurse{4}{ is only here : \stopcolumns} ? I want to test this file without the dorecurse command, with a long aristotelian text and its latin translation within more than a recto/verso set (or both pages and an only /odd/even set). But I want to know, before doing such a test, why this configuration with a sample doesn't work. As attached file see the PDF of the *.tex source below. Thanks to all ! JP \setuplanguage[agr][patterns={agr, la}] \mainlanguage[agr] % Greek as main language \definefallbackfamily [mainface] [serif] [GFS Didot] [preset=range:greek] \definefontfamily [mainface] [serif] [TeX Gyre Pagella] \setuplayout[header=2cm, footer=2cm] \usemodule[newcolumnsets] \setupnotes[compress=yes] \setupnotations[alternative=serried] \definelinenote[aNote] \definelinenote[bNote][n=2] \definelinenote[cNote][n=3] \definelinenote[dNote][paragraph=yes] \def\ANote#1#2{#1\aNote{#1] #2}} \def\BNote#1#2{#1\bNote{#1] #2}} \def\CNote#1#2{#1\cNote{#1] #2}} \def\DNote#1#2{#1\dNote{#1] #2}} \setupalign[hz, hanging] \setuptolerance[strict] \setuplinenumbering[step=5, location=inright, distance=1ex, align=center, width=0.5em] \definemargindata[Stephanus][location=inner, distance=2ex, style=\em] \setupbodyfont[mainface, 7.8pt] \definecolumnset[example][n=2, balance=yes] \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \stop \startcolumns[example] \dorecurse{4}{ \Stephanus{1a} Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος, οἷον ζῷον ὅ τε ἄνθρωπος καὶ τὸ γεγραμμένον· τούτων γὰρ ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα λόγος τῆς οὐσίας ἕτερος· ἐὰν γὰρ ἀποδιδῷ τις τί ἐστιν αὐτῶν ἑκατέρῳ τὸ ζῴῳ εἶναι, ἴδιον ἑκατέρου λόγον ἀποδώσει. \column \startlinenumbering[continue] Aequivoca dicuntur quorum \CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero \ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} \ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal \DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est, secundum nomen vero substantiae ratio diversa; si enim quis assignet quid est utrique eorum quo sint animalia, propriam assignabit utriusque rationem. \stoplinenumbering \stopcolumns} \stoptext ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Lundi 16 Mai 2016 20:19:51 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/16/2016 06:25 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

...

...

[...] \dorecurse only avoids copying the same text again and again.

I dont know how to manage Hans proposal : I've tried to deal with it and the visible effect is to place footnotes in the column on the right. Maye I'll have to test with a longer text without the \dorecurse command ...

\setupmixedcolumns seems to misplace the notes. At least on my sample. Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Pablo, Thanks to have correct my mistake. It works ! If you take this sample and place the number 8 in \dorecurse{4} in place of 4, you'll see something which is better than our first attempts. Now, it's only the last paragraph of the first page, which is messed up. After a somehow puzzled or erratic Wille zu Macht in the location of this last paragraph, ConTeXt locates very fine the last ones and does what it has to do ! But it's better to say that my code is weak ... JP ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Vendredi 20 Mai 2016 20:26:32 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/20/2016 01:37 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

...

Allright ! Then, I have listening this advice and there is the new code (on the basis of Pablo's work); I've only added declarations lines as \usemodule[newcolumnsets], and \definecolumnset[example][n=2, balance=yes]. The result is almost satisfying, because 'criticus apparatus' is well printed in footnotes, the numbering lines okay and

[...] the first 2 texts (greek and latin paragraphs) quite well printed in two face to face columns. BUT, I don't understand why after a good print, all is messed up. Is it because the closing bracket after \dorecurse{4}{ is only here : \stopcolumns} ?

Hi Jean-Pierre, see the explanation below.

\startcolumns[example] \dorecurse{4}{

\Stephanus{1a} Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα [...] \stopcolumns}

You start the columns outside the loop and after you stop the columns for the first time, they aren’t started again with each loop. Your code should read:

\dorecurse{4}{ \startcolumns[example]

\Stephanus{1a} Ὁμώνυμα λέγεται ὧν ὄνομα μόνον κοινόν, ὁ δὲ κατὰ τοὔνομα [...] \stopcolumns}

I hope it helps, Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Pablo, I'm trying to find a path through the 2 columns set greek-latin with 'criticus apparatus'. 1. If you put a bigger text for avoid the \dorecurse command, with \definecolumnset[example][n=2, balance=yes] in the preamble, then the following coding (note: \startcolumnset and \stopcolumnset commands), all is well as ends well IF ONLY the text's length is less than a page. If the text length is larger than one page, there is a mismatch as a result, where the latin text goes is overprinted on the French text and the footnotes are overprinted by the Greek text. 2. Moreover, if you comment the \dorecurse command, with a short Greek and Latin text (only a paragraph each), all the notes are well printed, the same for the numbering line, but the French text is overprinted by the right column Latin ! (Points 1., and 2. without ConteXt complaining or any error in the log file. 3. Now, return to the \dorecurse command, as follow : \dorecurse{8}{ \startcolumnset[example]{ \Stephanus{1a} [1a] Ὁμώνυμα [...greek text...] etc. The result is the same as point 2. I conclude there is a problem with the columnset command... 4. Now, I wonder if there is not a problem with brackets around the Greek-Latin text... Jp \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \stop % \dorecurse{8}{ \startcolumnset[example]{ \Stephanus{1a} [1a] Ὁμώνυμα [...greek text...] \column \startlinenumbering[continue] Aequivoca dicuntur quorum \CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero \ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} \ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal \DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est [...Latin text...] \stoplinenumbering \stopcolumnset} \stoptext ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Vendredi 20 Mai 2016 23:02:34 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/20/2016 09:51 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo,

Thanks to have correct my mistake. It works ! If you take this sample and place the number 8 in \dorecurse{4} in place of 4, you'll see something which is better than our first attempts. Now, it's only the last paragraph of the first page, which is messed up. After a somehow puzzled or erratic Wille zu Macht in the location of this last paragraph, ConTeXt locates very fine the last ones and does what it has to do ! But it's better to say that my code is weak ...

Hi Jean-Pierre, there is something weird with columns and the last paragraph. Even using exactly the same text for both left and right columns (as shown in https://mailman.ntg.nl/pipermail/ntg-context/2016/085544.html), the paragraph on the left fits on the first page, but the paragraph on the right doesn’t. Well, if that isn’t a bug, I’d like to know what I’m missing there. Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

Hi Pablo and others columns addicts ! I answer to myself, trying to understand why there is a mismatch when trying to parse a bunch of pages with 2 columns. It seems to have a problem with filling the page, even on the first page. I get back to basics and to the documentation, testing an explicit sample (sample 901, page 45, on numbering lines on 2 columns set). I change the section title and I copy/paste the first paragraph of an english translation of an Aristotelian text. I put 'regular' instead of 'bold' for numbering lines. Please, would you mind to test this following code ? JP \usemodule[newcolumnsets] \definecolumnset[example][n=2,page=middle,distance=1cm] \setupcolumnset [example] [background=contrast] % \definecolor[fakerulecolor][white] \faketriggertrue \setuphead [section] [style=\bfd] \setuplinenumbering [style=regular, distance=0pt, align=inner] \starttext \startcolumnset[example] \dorecurse{30}{ \startsection[title=Things are said to be named #1] \startlinenumbering Things are said to be named 'equivocally' when, though they have a common name, the definition corresponding with the name differs for each. Thus, a real man and a figure in a picture can both lay claim to the name 'animal'; yet these are equivocally so named, for, though they have a common name, the definition corresponding with the name differs for each. For should any one define in what sense each is an animal, his definition in the one case will be appropriate to that case only.\par \stoplinenumbering \stopsection} \stopcolumnset \stoptext ----- Mail original ----- De: "Jean-Pierre Delange" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Dimanche 22 Mai 2016 09:20:16 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? Hi Pablo, Reading the documentation again (i.e. columnsets.pdf), I see that the module \definecolumnset[example][n=2] allow how to define how many pages we want a set of columns, each of one being define with its own number of lines and so on. Therefore, the behaviour of the first page will be different of the second, etc. Further, one have to imagine a first recto (odd) page blank, followed by an even page (even, left page) with a double columns (greek-latin text) and the next third page (odd one) with commentaries. Then, one have to define the layout, because the number of lines of the greek-latin text on left page has to fit with the commentaries on the right page (and because it is not the same layout). Moreover, one can imagine for the moment a printed odd page (on left page) and a blank one (on the right page). Maybe it is this behaviour (when a page is filled)- and necessary there is another behaviour to deal with when context parse for the even page - about which we have to scrutinize. The purpose of columnset module is to set how many column for a single page and how to fit this columns to a number of defined pages (with titles and pictures). Its goal is not to make separate columns on the same page. At least as far as I can understand the process. JP ----- Mail original ----- De: "Jean-Pierre Delange" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Samedi 21 Mai 2016 12:16:44 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? Hi Pablo, I'm trying to find a path through the 2 columns set greek-latin with 'criticus apparatus'. 1. If you put a bigger text for avoid the \dorecurse command, with \definecolumnset[example][n=2, balance=yes] in the preamble, then the following coding (note: \startcolumnset and \stopcolumnset commands), all is well as ends well IF ONLY the text's length is less than a page. If the text length is larger than one page, there is a mismatch as a result, where the latin text goes is overprinted on the French text and the footnotes are overprinted by the Greek text. 2. Moreover, if you comment the \dorecurse command, with a short Greek and Latin text (only a paragraph each), all the notes are well printed, the same for the numbering line, but the French text is overprinted by the right column Latin ! (Points 1., and 2. without ConteXt complaining or any error in the log file. 3. Now, return to the \dorecurse command, as follow : \dorecurse{8}{ \startcolumnset[example]{ \Stephanus{1a} [1a] Ὁμώνυμα [...greek text...] etc. The result is the same as point 2. I conclude there is a problem with the columnset command... 4. Now, I wonder if there is not a problem with brackets around the Greek-Latin text... Jp \starttext \start\fr % some text in French Définir un apparat critique et le mettre en page avec un traitement de texte courant est un véritable casse-tête. LaTeX et ConTeXt offrent des outils d'automatisation encore assez mal connus dans la communauté des éditeurs, notamment dans l'édition savante, pour la collation et la comparaison de textes médiévaux.\par \stop % \dorecurse{8}{ \startcolumnset[example]{ \Stephanus{1a} [1a] Ὁμώνυμα [...greek text...] \column \startlinenumbering[continue] Aequivoca dicuntur quorum \CNote{nomen}{première note} solum commune est, secundum nomen vero \ANote{substantiae}{seconde note} \ANote{ratio}{seconde note} diversa, ut animal \DNote{homo}{troisième note} et quod pingitur. Horum enim solum nomen commune est [...Latin text...] \stoplinenumbering \stopcolumnset} \stoptext ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Vendredi 20 Mai 2016 23:02:34 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/20/2016 09:51 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo,

Thanks to have correct my mistake. It works ! If you take this sample and place the number 8 in \dorecurse{4} in place of 4, you'll see something which is better than our first attempts. Now, it's only the last paragraph of the first page, which is messed up. After a somehow puzzled or erratic Wille zu Macht in the location of this last paragraph, ConTeXt locates very fine the last ones and does what it has to do ! But it's better to say that my code is weak ...

Hi Jean-Pierre, there is something weird with columns and the last paragraph. Even using exactly the same text for both left and right columns (as shown in https://mailman.ntg.nl/pipermail/ntg-context/2016/085544.html), the paragraph on the left fits on the first page, but the paragraph on the right doesn’t. Well, if that isn’t a bug, I’d like to know what I’m missing there. Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________ ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

On 5/21/2016 12:16 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo,

I'm trying to find a path through the 2 columns set greek-latin with 'criticus apparatus'.

i'm surprised that you something with columnsets at all (the notes part) ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Pablo, Your code is working perfectly well on Windows 10 with GFS Didot, if the \dorecurse command fullfill only one page. Indeed, there is an issue with paragraphs in balanced columns. But I am glad to have a sample for my documentation, which shows the way. I'll try to get through the issue with what Hans has given before in one of his messages. Thank you very warmly for your help. JP ----- Mail original ----- De: "Pablo Rodriguez" À: "mailing list for ConTeXt users" Envoyé: Lundi 16 Mai 2016 14:09:15 Objet: Re: [NTG-context] LaTeX reledmac: what about ConTeXt ? On 05/16/2016 01:12 PM, Jean-Pierre Delange wrote:

Hi Pablo,

2. I've tried to install GFS Didot on Windows, but I did'nt find TTF... And when I copy files in c:/windows/fonts, ce system complains. How do you do that ?

http://greekfontsociety.gr/_assets/fonts/GFS_Didot.zip contains both TTF and OTF files. How about showing file extensions to select the files you want? (http://www.thewindowsclub.com/show-file-extensions-in-windows)

5. Note that here, the \dorecurse{50} command seems to produce an unexpected effect : the latin text takes place of the greek one with its lines numbers (I really don't know if the \dorecurse commande is

I don’t think this is caused by \dorecurse. But column balance seems to be a tricky issue.

(Something out of the topic : under Linux, when I load GFS Didot, after reloading fonts (with mtxrun --script fonts --reload), I don't see the GFS fonts, with the command mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=didot* --all. Strange, isn't it ?)

How about the following? (Your command works fine for me) mtxrun --script fonts --list --pattern=*didot* --all Just in case it helps, Pablo -- http://www.ousia.tk ___________________________________________________________________________________ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___________________________________________________________________________________

On 13 May 2016, at 17:51, Aditya Mahajan wrote:

On Fri, 13 May 2016, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

There may not be so many symbols: the “large operators" in the Tex Book, p. 435, though Unicode have more, and some others like √ U+221A for \sqrt.

If you want, you can collect such mappings in a separate module.

That would be a good idea if it should become a part of a ConTeXt distribution.

...

I could not make your code working - does it require a later LuaTex version (than 0.80.0)?

Here is a complete working example

This example generates an error (ConTeXt 0.61 with TeX Live 2015): tex error > error on line 10 in file limits0.tex: ! Undefined control sequence <inserted text> ...ries \catcode `∫=\activecatcode \letcharcode `∫ \int <everymath> ...\vcenter \normalvcenter \the \everymathematics \setfalse \indisplaymath <to be read again> \int l.10 Nolimits $\int _0^∞ f ω$, and $∫_0^∞ f ω$

(OT: The location of the limit is still ugly with xits fonts)

Also long spacing after the integral sign if there are no limits.

On 13 May 2016, at 21:46, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

This example generates an error (ConTeXt 0.61 with TeX Live 2015):

for older engines

\installanddefineactivecharacter `∫ {\int}

\appendtoks \catcode`∫=\activecatcode \to \everymathematics

That does not work either. I can hack it up though using \catcode`\∫=\active \let∫\int

but best you can update as most here run the latest version

Tex Live 2016 is about to be released in few weeks time [1], so hopefully, it has a later version. Final updates May 16. 1. https://www.tug.org/texlive/

On 13 May 2016, at 22:53, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

Tex Live 2016 is about to be released in few weeks time [1], so hopefully, it has a later version. Final updates May 16.

1. https://www.tug.org/texlive/

you can install the version from the context garden alongside (independent) ... that way you're always up to date

Thanks for the tip. I have done such manual updates in the past, with package chasing including recursive packages, but a down period right now. Even a developer of Bison uses GCC from MacPorts. Perhaps there should be a live update of TeX Live instead.

On 14 May 2016, at 01:25, Hans Hagen wrote:

installing and running the garden distribution is quite simple (as is updating) .. there are less files too (so no big burden to have it alongside tex live)

I installed it on OS X 10.11.5 Beta in /Applications/ConTeXt. Then it turns out that adding ‘context’ to the PATH by a script exec /Applications/ConTeXt/tex/texmf-osx-64/bin/context "$@“ isn’t enough, because it gets hold of the older LuaTeX version from TeX Live 2015 which is also in the path. However, running ‘setuptex’ works. One can download a LilyPond binary to /Applications/, and its binaries then has lookup paths set properly to itself. Then scripts as those above have the advantage of not interfering with other binaries with the same name.

On Sat, 14 May 2016, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

On 14 May 2016, at 01:25, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

installing and running the garden distribution is quite simple (as is updating) .. there are less files too (so no big burden to have it alongside tex live)

With this installation, I get a strange bug:

In the example below, the first integral gets ‘limits' in the displayed formula, as though ‘nolimits’ has not been defined. It works if one puts a character before the first integral sign. So it seems that the \startformula command misses the ∫ definition on the first non-space character.

I haven't debugged this, but my guess is that the int symbol is read before \everymathematics is executed (because \startformula is looking ahead for the optional arguments in [...] and the only way to do so is read the next symbol and check if it is [). Use \startformula\relax ... \stopformula Aditya

On Sat, 14 May 2016, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

On 14 May 2016, at 18:41, Aditya Mahajan wrote:

On Sat, 14 May 2016, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

...

On 14 May 2016, at 01:25, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

installing and running the garden distribution is quite simple (as is updating) .. there are less files too (so no big burden to have it alongside tex live)

With this installation, I get a strange bug:

In the example below, the first integral gets ‘limits' in the displayed formula, as though ‘nolimits’ has not been defined. It works if one puts a character before the first integral sign. So it seems that the \startformula command misses the ∫ definition on the first non-space character.

I haven't debugged this, but my guess is that the int symbol is read before \everymathematics is executed (because \startformula is looking ahead for the optional arguments in [...] and the only way to do so is read the next symbol and check if it is [).

Use \startformula\relax ... \stopformula

Just about anything seems to work: I put in an empty group \startformula{} ... \stopformula

Be careful with empty group in math mode: \startformula{} -a \stopformula \startformula\relax -a \stopformula Aditya

On Sun, May 15, 2016 at 10:10 AM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

On 14 May 2016, at 23:26, Aditya Mahajan wrote:

...

...

...

Use \startformula\relax ... \stopformula

Just about anything seems to work: I put in an empty group \startformula{} ... \stopformula

Be careful with empty group in math mode:

\startformula{} -a \stopformula \startformula\relax -a \stopformula

A good example, illustrating a difference between \relax and {}, whatever it may be. I used it just to save some typing in a workaround. It must start with an integral sign having at least one limit: \startformula ∫_a f φ\stopformula \startformula{} ∫_a f φ\stopformula \startformula\, ∫_a f φ\stopformula \startformula\relax ∫_a f φ\stopformula

Without limits, I get too much space after the integral sign: \startformula ∫ f φ\stopformula

Maybe it's a little unkown but under standalone-mkiv-experimental/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/interface/mkiv there is i-formula.xml $>context i-formula.xml -- luigi

On 5/15/2016 2:33 PM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

On 14 May 2016, at 23:26, Aditya Mahajan wrote:

...

Be careful with empty group in math mode:

\startformula{} -a \stopformula \startformula\relax -a \stopformula

Maybe a way to distinguish between unary prefix operator “-“, and binary infix operator “-“: {} is interpreted as an empty operand, thus infix “-", whereas \relax is removed from the input meaning no operand, so prefix “-“. But \relax can have sub-/super-scripts, just as {}, and then in both cases, “–“ becomes binary:

\startformula {}^2 - a \stopformula \startformula \relax^2 - a \stopformula

why not use something more natural unicode \startformula \zwnj^2 - a \stopformula ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

On 15 May 2016, at 19:14, Hans Hagen wrote:

On 5/15/2016 2:33 PM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

...

On 14 May 2016, at 23:26, Aditya Mahajan wrote:

...

Be careful with empty group in math mode:

\startformula{} -a \stopformula \startformula\relax -a \stopformula

Maybe a way to distinguish between unary prefix operator “-“, and binary infix operator “-“: {} is interpreted as an empty operand, thus infix “-", whereas \relax is removed from the input meaning no operand, so prefix “-“. But \relax can have sub-/super-scripts, just as {}, and then in both cases, “–“ becomes binary:

\startformula {}^2 - a \stopformula \startformula \relax^2 - a \stopformula

why not use something more natural unicode

\startformula \zwnj^2 - a \stopformula

The TeX Book recommends using {} for superscripts to the lefts side, eg. \startformula {}_a^b C_d^e \stopformula What is \zwnj?

On 15 May 2016, at 19:35, Wolfgang Schuster wrote:

...

Hans Åberg 15. Mai 2016 um 19:32

What is \zwnj? zero width non-joiner

OK. Invisibles of different semantic meaning are pretty tricky to use in the input, because it is hard to detect errors.

On 15 May 2016, at 20:00, Hans Hagen wrote:

On 5/15/2016 7:44 PM, Hans Åberg wrote:

...

Invisibles of different semantic meaning are pretty tricky to use in the input, because it is hard to detect errors.

a proper monospace editor font would show it

In the Xcode text editor, one can show invisibles, but it does not tell which one, just showing a diamond, except for the NO-BREAK SPACE U+00A0, shown just as a space. In the mono-space font they are equal. If switching to the STIX fonts, suitable for math, then there is no THIN SPACE U+2009, so the editor switches to Lucida, in which it is nearly as wide as the no-break space. Otherwise, this editor has good Unicode support. So \, and \! will prevail, though it might be nice to have visually less intrusive commands.

On 13 May 2016, at 12:22, Hans Hagen wrote:

in principle one can make ∫ and \int but that has other side effects

\appendtoks \catcode`∫=\activecatcode \to \everymathematics

One should add \def\∫{∫} before the code above. This way one can use both. For example: \setupbodyfont[xits,10pt] \def\∫{∫} \appendtoks \catcode`∫=\activecatcode \letcharcode `∫ \int \to \everymathematics \setupmathematics[integral=nolimits] Nolimits $\int_0^∞ f ω$, and $∫_0^∞ f ω$, and $\∫_0^∞ f ω$. \startformula\relax ∫_0^∞ f ω, \quad \∫_0^∞ f ω, \quad \int_0^∞ f ω \stopformula