# [NTG-pdftex] images in formats

Hans Hagen pragma at wxs.nl
Thu Jun 28 13:01:48 CEST 2007

```David Kastrup wrote:
> Hans Hagen <pragma at wxs.nl> writes:
>
>> Frank Küster wrote:
>>> Hans Hagen <pragma at wxs.nl> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Thanh Han The wrote:
>>>>> dumping an image in pdf mode is rather difficult to get
>>>>> right. If in dvi mode an image is "stored" by a reference to
>>>>> an external file, then I am afraid the speed gain is not
>>>>> that much. There is for sure some comfort by having a dumped
>>>>> file reference in the format, but again that can be also
>>>>> achieved for pdf mode using some macros IMHO.
>>>> to me it looks like a rather useless option to include an image in a
>>>> format, just as we don't embed type 1 fonts in the format either so
>>>> let's not waste energy on it
>>> You know that you just said "To me it looks like a rather useless
>>> option to include an image in a \savebox in the LaTeX preamble", or
>>> "To me it looks like a rather useless option to support
>>> preview-latex in PDF mode even for people who use \savebox with
>>> images in their preamble"?
>> no, i was talking about a 'format' i.e. a \dump'd thing, i have no
>> clue what \savebox does, and it may do image trickery as much as it
>> likes but in the end the image will not be in the format file
>
> Nor will it be in any output generated by iniTeX.  Do you think we
> should turn off PDF/DVI generation completely in iniTeX?  Prohibit
> people from generating visible output with it?  If not, then it is
> hard to explain why images should be treated differently from other
> material.

again, i'm not talking of initex, but about what can end up in a FORMAT
FILE and pdfimage data is not something to put in the format; initex can
of course include images in a produced pdf file; i never denied that
neiter did i say that initex shoul dnot produce dvi/pdf output

> I find it annoying how legitimate concerns and existing _standard_ use
> cases and packages are simply brushed aside or ignored.  While there
> may be priorities that make it necessary to postpone a proper
> implementation, it is not because people putting forward their
> concerns and presenting their use cases are idiots or weirdos that can
> safely be ignored.

again, we're talking of pdf data ending up in formats as a result of a
ref to an xform, not about macro packages; instead of embedding the
graphic one could use a reference to an external file (using an media
related annotation) but that's something at the macro level and not
pdftex internals

Hans

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