[NTG-context] bibliography again: “von” and “van”

Hans Hagen pragma at wxs.nl
Sat Jan 31 11:18:44 CET 2015

On 1/28/2015 4:10 AM, Alan BRASLAU wrote:
> I have been arguing with Hans over the proper treatment of "particles",
> in general. The rules vary greatly - here we are looking at a
> comparison between Dutch and German practice. In French, the use often
> depends on history differing before and after the revolution. In
> Spanish, we have other practice.
> One solution is to make the rendering depend on the "language=" bibtex
> field. But this does not work universally. With Hans, we have extended
> the bibtex standard so that names can be explicitly separated, as in:
> author = {particle, lastname, suffix, firstname}
> This allows the author to use a free form for each component without
> resorting to any bibtex trickery (like capitalization or not). How
> these components are handled or rendered is not entirely worked out.
> Indeed, the German practice differs from others. Thus my suggestion of
> the use of the language field (or setting).

I've added a tracer for authors. The main problem with authors is that 
bibtex was never set up to multilingual (there has been written and 
talked a lot about it by Jean Micheakl Hufflen who made a multilingual 

So, in order to deal with names, the way to go is roughly as follows:

- multiple names are separated by 'and' (hopefully there are no parents 
who names their kids This and That)

- when a name has no commas it gets analyzed and split according to some 
heuristics ... there is not that much we can do about it (but we try to 
catch as much as possible) ... this can mean that a particle is seen as 
one of the surnames but that is seldom a big issue as eventually the 
name gets combined again

- in the mkiv publication subsystem names travel around in their split 
form: initials, firstnames, vons (bad name, might change), surnames, 
juniors (also bad name), so

Alan Xavier von Braslau jr becomes

[A X] [Alan Xavier] [von] [Braslau] [jr]

Now that can can never be robust expecially when names are written in 
full, so that is why we look at names with commas differnetly:

Alan Xavier Braslau


[A X] [Alan Xavier] [] [Braslau] []


Xavier Braslau, Alan


[A] [Alan] [] [Xavier Braslau] []

the snippets in a two element name is still analyzed according to some 

When there are more snippets (where {} indicates an empty snippet) the 
filling of the record depends on the amount of snippets. In principle 
you can have of them, including the initials if they are kind of special.)

Keep in mind that there is nothing like a bibtex standard (and it's 
still beta anyway awaiting version 1).

Here is a test:


     author = { Foo Bar von Something },
     title  = { Whatever 1 },
     year   = { 2015 }

     author = { Foo Bar von Something and John Doe },
     title  = { Whatever 2 },
     year   = { 2015 }

     author = { von Something, Foo Bar and John Doe },
     title  = { Whatever 3 },
     year   = { 2015 }

     author = { {}, von Something, Foo Bar and John Doe },
     title  = { Whatever 4 },
     year   = { 2015 }

     author = { {}, von Something, {}, Foo Bar and John Doe },
     title  = { Whatever 5 },
     year   = { 2015 }

     author = { {}, {von Something}, {}, Foo Bar, FoBa and John Doe },
     title  = { Whatever 6 },
     year   = { 2015 }









Of course we can add all kind of manipulators when typesetting them, but 
adding all kind of complex tweaks to the input makes no sense: (1) I 
can't remember them as till now i never needed a bibliography myself, 
and (2) Alan can't document them because there are to many demands and 
options but above all (3) only one user will use that specific tweak and 
forgets about it after that specific thesis demand was met.


ps. As one has access to the loaded bib data it is always possible to 
writ every specific renderers given willingness to mess with Lua.

                                           Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE
               Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands
     tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com
                                              | www.pragma-pod.nl

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