Umlaut causes footnotline to jump
Hi, again, unfortunately close to the printing, we have found an insoluble ugly detail in the footnotes. There is a very strange thing with german umlaut (actually it took me 2 hours to see this point). Have a look at the example below: When you change the \"O to O the interlinespace snaps back to its correct value. But \"O (or Ü the same) does not always distort the interlinespace. It's just sometimes (and to me unpredictably...). As it is a quite striking feature it needs to be corrected -- but how?? \usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac] \setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt] \definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no] \def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt} \starttext Test.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, Öff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext Steffen
Steffen Wolfrum wrote:
Hi,
again, unfortunately close to the printing, we have found an insoluble ugly detail in the footnotes. There is a very strange thing with german umlaut (actually it took me 2 hours to see this point).
Have a look at the example below: When you change the \"O to O the interlinespace snaps back to its correct value. But \"O (or � the same) does not always distort the interlinespace. It's just sometimes (and to me unpredictably...).
As it is a quite striking feature it needs to be corrected -- but how??
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no]
\def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt}
\starttext Test.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, �ff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext
no bug at all \usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt] \starttext \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt] \dontleavehmode\setbox\scratchbox\hbox {O}\copy\scratchbox : \the\ht\scratchbox,\the\dp\scratchbox,\the\htdp\scratchbox\crlf \dontleavehmode\setbox\scratchbox\hbox{\"O}\copy\scratchbox : \the\ht\scratchbox,\the\dp\scratchbox,\the\htdp\scratchbox\crlf line:\the\lineheight,ht:\the\strutht,dp:\the\strutdp,total:\the\htdp\strutbox\crlf \stoptext your lineheight is too small, andin this case the line with teh \"O has at least .5pt more height than assumed max ht, and sincethe lines touch then, will force an extra interlineskip of 1pt whether or not you observe this is a coincidence since in many cases lines have ht/dp < the max values -- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry, I don't understand this. Please take a look at this more realistic, extended example: \usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac] \setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt] \definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no] \def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt} \starttext Test 1.\footnote{BVerwGE 17, 306, 309; 65, 167, 174; {\em Dürig}, in: Maunz{|/|}Dürig, GG, Sonderdruck, Art.\,2~I Rn.\,48; auch heute wird dies noch z.\,T. so gesehen, z.\,B. bei {\em Arndt}, in: Steiner, BesVerwR, VII~B, Rn.\,131; {\em Schünemann}, in: GroßKomm. UWG, Rn.\,A~65; auch das \"O OVG Münster, NWVBl. 2005, 68, 70, scheint die grundrechtlich geschützte Wettbewerbsfreiheit nicht als eine Ausprägung der Berufsfreiheit zu sehen.} Test 2.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, Öff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext What is the difference between footnote 1 and footnote 2, why does the \"O on footnote 1 fit in its line and not in footnote 2? There have both interlinespace[line=9.8pt] ... Steffen On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 17:23:22 +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
no bug at all
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\starttext
\switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]
\dontleavehmode\setbox\scratchbox\hbox {O}\copy\scratchbox : \the\ht\scratchbox,\the\dp\scratchbox,\the\htdp\scratchbox\crlf \dontleavehmode\setbox\scratchbox\hbox{\"O}\copy\scratchbox : \the\ht\scratchbox,\the\dp\scratchbox,\the\htdp\scratchbox\crlf line:\the\lineheight,ht:\the\strutht,dp:\the\strutdp,total:\the\htdp\strutbox\crlf
\stoptext
your lineheight is too small, andin this case the line with teh \"O has at least .5pt more height than assumed max ht, and sincethe lines touch then, will force an extra interlineskip of 1pt
whether or not you observe this is a coincidence since in many cases lines have ht/dp < the max values
--
----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------
Steffen Wolfrum wrote:
Sorry, I don't understand this. Please take a look at this more realistic, extended example:
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no]
\def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt}
\starttext Test 1.\footnote{BVerwGE 17, 306, 309; 65, 167, 174; {\em D�rig}, in: Maunz{|/|}D�rig, GG, Sonderdruck, Art.\,2~I Rn.\,48; auch heute wird dies noch z.\,T. so gesehen, z.\,B. bei {\em Arndt}, in: Steiner, BesVerwR, VII~B, Rn.\,131; {\em Sch�nemann}, in: Gro�Komm. UWG, Rn.\,A~65; auch das \"O OVG M�nster, NWVBl. 2005, 68, 70, scheint die grundrechtlich gesch�tzte Wettbewerbsfreiheit nicht als eine Auspr�gung der Berufsfreiheit zu sehen.}
Test 2.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, �ff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext
What is the difference between footnote 1 and footnote 2, why does the \"O on footnote 1 fit in its line and not in footnote 2? There have both interlinespace[line=9.8pt] ...
the height and depth of the line as calculated by tex based on the actual text; 9.8 pt lineheight is nog enough to squeeze the char with the most height and depth in so you need to choose a larger value than 9.8pt (and maybe set lineskip to 0pt)
Steffen
On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 17:23:22 +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
no bug at all
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\starttext
\switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]
\dontleavehmode\setbox\scratchbox\hbox {O}\copy\scratchbox : \the\ht\scratchbox,\the\dp\scratchbox,\the\htdp\scratchbox\crlf \dontleavehmode\setbox\scratchbox\hbox{\"O}\copy\scratchbox : \the\ht\scratchbox,\the\dp\scratchbox,\the\htdp\scratchbox\crlf line:\the\lineheight,ht:\the\strutht,dp:\the\strutdp,total:\the\htdp\strutbox\crlf
\stoptext
your lineheight is too small, andin this case the line with teh \"O has at least .5pt more height than assumed max ht, and sincethe lines touch then, will force an extra interlineskip of 1pt
whether or not you observe this is a coincidence since in many cases lines have ht/dp < the max values
--
----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------
-- ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------
On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 18:05:41 +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no]
\def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt} \starttext Test 1.\footnote{BVerwGE 17, 306, 309; 65, 167, 174; {\em D╴rig}, in: Maunz{|/|}D╴rig, GG, Sonderdruck, Art.\,2~I Rn.\,48; auch heute wird dies noch z.\,T. so gesehen, z.\,B. bei {\em Arndt}, in: Steiner, BesVerwR, VII~B, Rn.\,131; {\em Sch╴nemann}, in: Gro╴ Komm. UWG, Rn.\,A~65; auch das \"O OVG M╴nster, NWVBl. 2005, 68, 70, scheint die grundrechtlich gesch╴tzte Wettbewerbsfreiheit nicht als eine Auspr╴gung der Berufsfreiheit zu sehen.}
Test 2.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, ╴ff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext
What is the difference between footnote 1 and footnote 2, why does the \"O on footnote 1 fit in its line and not in footnote 2? There have both interlinespace[line=9.8pt] ...
the height and depth of the line as calculated by tex based on the actual text; 9.8 pt lineheight is nog enough to squeeze the char with the most height and depth in so you need to choose a larger value than 9.8pt (and maybe set lineskip to 0pt)
The awkward thing about this is that the chosen values are given by the publishers... After some trying I saw that interlinespace[line=10.6pt] instead of 9.8pt would work. But this far beyond. The document I am working on is to be published as part of a series. So I can't change the footnote's interlinespace from 9.8pt to 10.6pt! Is there truly no other workaround? Steffen
Steffen Wolfrum wrote:
On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 18:05:41 +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no]
\def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt} \starttext Test 1.\footnote{BVerwGE 17, 306, 309; 65, 167, 174; {\em D╴rig}, in: Maunz{|/|}D╴rig, GG, Sonderdruck, Art.\,2~I Rn.\,48; auch heute wird dies noch z.\,T. so gesehen, z.\,B. bei {\em Arndt}, in: Steiner, BesVerwR, VII~B, Rn.\,131; {\em Sch╴nemann}, in: Gro╴ Komm. UWG, Rn.\,A~65; auch das \"O OVG M╴nster, NWVBl. 2005, 68, 70, scheint die grundrechtlich gesch╴tzte Wettbewerbsfreiheit nicht als eine Auspr╴gung der Berufsfreiheit zu sehen.}
Test 2.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, ╴ff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext
What is the difference between footnote 1 and footnote 2, why does the \"O on footnote 1 fit in its line and not in footnote 2? There have both interlinespace[line=9.8pt] ...
the height and depth of the line as calculated by tex based on the actual text; 9.8 pt lineheight is nog enough to squeeze the char with the most height and depth in so you need to choose a larger value than 9.8pt (and maybe set lineskip to 0pt)
The awkward thing about this is that the chosen values are given by the publishers...
After some trying I saw that interlinespace[line=10.6pt] instead of 9.8pt would work. But this far beyond. The document I am working on is to be published as part of a series. So I can't change the footnote's interlinespace from 9.8pt to 10.6pt!
Is there truly no other workaround?
hi steffen, you can try to lower the baseline for the footnotes by changing the relation of height and depth. this way you get a different \strut (same total height, but bigger height part). i think the \strut command is also the cause of the different appearance in your two examples (add \showstruts after \startext; \strut and Ö in the same line..). try something like setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt,height=.79,depth=.21] the values are font dependent and probably don't fit here (taken from my experiments with ms-sansserif). if i remember it right the default values are height=.72 and depth=.28 . hth, peter
Steffen _______________________________________________ ntg-context mailing list ntg-context@ntg.nl http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context
Peter that's it, that is exactly the kind of adjustment what I was looking for. Thank you very, very much! Steffen On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 19:50:21 +0100, Peter Rolf wrote:
you can try to lower the baseline for the footnotes by changing the relation of height and depth. this way you get a different \strut (same total height, but bigger height part). i think the \strut command is also the cause of the different appearance in your two examples (add \showstruts after \startext; \strut and Ö in the same line..).
try something like
setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt,height=.79,depth=.21]
the values are font dependent and probably don't fit here (taken from my experiments with ms-sansserif). if i remember it right the default values are height=.72 and depth=.28 .
On Thu, 15 Mar 2007 18:05:41 +0100, Hans Hagen wrote:
\usetypescript[postscript][\defaultencoding] \setupencoding[default=texnansi] \mainlanguage[de] \enableregime[mac]
\setupbodyfont[postscript,10pt] \setupinterlinespace[line=12pt]
\definepapersize[MyPage][width=15.7cm,height=23.2cm] \setuppapersize[MyPage][A4] \setuplayout [width=113mm,height=576pt, backspace=20mm,topspace=15mm, header=12pt,headerdistance=6pt, footer=42pt,footerdistance=0pt, location=middle,marking=on,grid=no]
\def\setnotebodyfont {\let\setnotebodyfont\relax \restoreglobalbodyfont \switchtobodyfont[rm,9pt]\setupinterlinespace[line=9.8pt]\parskip2pt} \starttext Test 1.\footnote{BVerwGE 17, 306, 309; 65, 167, 174; {\em D°Zrig}, in: Maunz{|/|}D°Zrig, GG, Sonderdruck, Art.\,2~I Rn.\,48; auch heute wird dies noch z.\,T. so gesehen, z.\,B. bei {\em Arndt}, in: Steiner, BesVerwR, VII~B, Rn.\,131; {\em Sch°Znemann}, in: Gro°Z Komm. UWG, Rn.\,A~65; auch das \"O OVG M°Znster, NWVBl. 2005, 68, 70, scheint die grundrechtlich gesch°Ztzte Wettbewerbsfreiheit nicht als eine Auspr°Zgung der Berufsfreiheit zu sehen.}
Test 2.\footnote{{\em R.~Schmidt}, °Zff. Wirtschaftsrecht, AT, S.\,163; {\em Manssen}, in: v.\,Mangoldt|\,/\,|Klein|\,/\,|Starck, GG, Bd.\,1, Art.\,12 Abs.\,1, Rn.\,70; {\em Schliesky}, Offentliches \"O Wettbewerbsrecht, S.\,197; {\em Tsiliotis}, Wettbewerbsfreiheit, S.\,65, mit vielen weiteren Nachweisen.} \stoptext
What is the difference between footnote 1 and footnote 2, why does the \"O on footnote 1 fit in its line and not in footnote 2? There have both interlinespace[line=9.8pt] ...
the height and depth of the line as calculated by tex based on the actual text; 9.8 pt lineheight is nog enough to squeeze the char with the most height and depth in so you need to choose a larger value than 9.8pt (and maybe set lineskip to 0pt)
The awkward thing about this is that the chosen values are given by the publishers... After some trying I saw that interlinespace[line=10.6pt] instead of 9.8pt would work. But this far beyond. The document I am working on is to be published as part of a series. So I can't change the footnote's interlinespace from 9.8pt to 10.6pt! Is there truly no other workaround? Steffen
Steffen Wolfrum wrote:
The awkward thing about this is that the chosen values are given by the publishers...
well, many designers and publishers are often not aware of these things (actually, in most of the styles i make for publishers i end up with not using any font or color system simply because there is no logic in the choices made); in luatex we can cheat by creating a virtual font with zero ht/dp glyphs but in tex this is not possible without changing font metrics
After some trying I saw that interlinespace[line=10.6pt] instead of 9.8pt would work. But this far beyond. The document I am working on is to be published as part of a series. So I can't change the footnote's interlinespace from 9.8pt to 10.6pt!
as suggested, you may try to change the ht/dp ratio and cross your fingers that no ( ) are used (or math with superscript)
Is there truly no other workaround?
no, it's like building a wall with 10cm heigh bricks and wanting 10 layers mount up to 80cm Hans Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------
participants (3)
-
Hans Hagen -
Peter Rolf -
Steffen Wolfrum