On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 21:47:08 -0700, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد wrote:

There is an modified version of scheherezade for TeX distros (Khaled and I played with it once upon a time) but I don't know where it is at the moment, as it's been ages since I worked on it. I thought it was part of the ConTeXt distro already but I could not find it. I'll check into it later. Khaled, do you have that modified scheherezade somewhere?

The modified Scheherezade is called SimpleNaskhi.ttf, I assume Khaled has the latest version. Hans, Mojca: I suggest going ahead and making SimpleNaskhi the default arabic-script unicode fallback for MkIV: \definefontfeature[simplearabic] [mode=node,language=dflt,script=arab, init=yes,medi=yes,fina=yes,calt=yes, rlig=yes,curs=yes,mark=yes,mkmk=yes] It is a very unicode-complete font, while -- as the name suggests -- quite simple in features. For fallbacks we need: [arabic,arabicpresentationformsa,arabicpresentationformsb, arabicsupplement,0x200C,0x200D] we have to play with rscale to get the right balance with LM I guess... If SimpleNaskhi is somehow broken or unavailable then we just go with ScheherazadeRegOT.ttf as the default font. [BTW: I think we discussed this 18 months or so ago...] Best wishes Idris -- Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief International Journal of Shīʿī Studies Department of Philosophy Colorado State University Fort Collins, CO 80523

On Sun, Nov 28, 2010 at 09:47:08PM -0700, Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد wrote:

There is an modified version of scheherezade for TeX distros (Khaled and I played with it once upon a time) but I don't know where it is at the moment, as it's been ages since I worked on it. I thought it was part of the ConTeXt distro already but I could not find it. I'll check into it later.

Khaled, do you have that modified scheherezade somewhere?

I've to dig for it, I'm sure it is there somewhere. However, I've long abandoned the idea of improving Scheherezade and instead concentrating on my own (Amiri) font, but it does not work with MkIV right now (and vowel marks are half done), so it is not a replacement yet. I do plan for a simplified version of Amiri that would fulfil the original goal of the modified Scheherezade font (and also developed in a way that works with most of the current broken OpenType implementations, unlike the current Amiri) and that one would be suitable as a default font, but this is months away at best. P.S. If any one interested in that Amiri font: http://amiri.sourceforge.net Regards, Khaled -- Khaled Hosny Arabic localiser and member of Arabeyes.org team Free font developer

2010/11/29 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد :

On Mon, 29 Nov 2010 11:03:06 -0700, Khaled Hosny wrote:

...

I've to dig for it, I'm sure it is there somewhere. However, I've long abandoned the idea of improving Scheherezade and instead concentrating on my own (Amiri) font, but it does not work with MkIV right now (and vowel marks are half done), so it is not a replacement yet. I do plan for a simplified version of Amiri that would fulfil the original goal of the modified Scheherezade font (and also developed in a way that works with most of the current broken OpenType implementations, unlike the current Amiri) and that one would be suitable as a default font, but this is months away at best.

OK: In that case, let's include the standard Scheharezade as is in the minimals until another unicode-complete font comes along. It has an Open Font License so should be no problem.

Miojca: Till then, where do you suggest placing Scheharezade in the tree?

tex/texmf/fonts/truetype/public/scheharezade ? -- luigi

2010/11/29 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد wrote:

On Mon, 29 Nov 2010 11:03:06 -0700, Khaled Hosny wrote:

OK: In that case, let's include the standard Scheharezade as is in the minimals until another unicode-complete font comes along. It has an Open Font License so should be no problem.

Mojca: Till then, where do you suggest placing Scheharezade in the tree?

If we make some font the default one ... it makes sense to put it on CTAN and include it in TeX Live as well, right? Mojca But then ... I somehow find it a bit weird to have Arabic fallback inside Latin Modern unless a user requests that explicitely and also says which font he wants to use. That it: I would suggest to have some setting that would tell exactly which glyphs to replace in the main font, which features to use ... but then the user would say that this font needs to be added. That is: are we also going to add Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Ethiopic, ... etc. scripts, all inside the one default font?

On Tue, 30 Nov 2010 04:50:58 -0700, Mojca Miklavec wrote:

2010/11/29 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد wrote:

...

On Mon, 29 Nov 2010 11:03:06 -0700, Khaled Hosny wrote:

OK: In that case, let's include the standard Scheharezade as is in the minimals until another unicode-complete font comes along. It has an Open Font License so should be no problem.

Mojca: Till then, where do you suggest placing Scheharezade in the tree?

If we make some font the default one ... it makes sense to put it on CTAN and include it in TeX Live as well, right?

Well, I only use ConTeXt;-) but TeXLive could use a default Arabic font as well for XeTeX (a fellow SIL project); surprised it's not there already ...

But then ... I somehow find it a bit weird to have Arabic fallback inside Latin Modern unless a user requests that explicitely and also says which font he wants to use. That it: I would suggest to have some setting that would tell exactly which glyphs to replace in the main font, which features to use ... but then the user would say that this font needs to be added.

What we need is for new users to be able to say, eg, \setmainlanguage[arabic] \setupdirections[bidi=global] % maybe this should be implied by \setmainlanguage[arabic] \starttext أهلا بالعالم! \stoptext And get Scheharezade without doing anything else. Indeed, especially once bidi is fully tested etc, one should be able to do just \starttext أهلا بالعالم! \stoptext and get correct Arabic output, with an implied \setupdirections[bidi=local] In other words, users need to be able to invoke default Arabic without doing really much of anything, just as they currently do with LM. Then users can switch fonts, adjust bidi controls, change features etc. Since LM has no Arabic, "replacement" of glyphs is not an issue, and Scheharezade is simple enough that a default feature set will suffice. Default Arabic boosts moral, attracts more users, saves time on the list, helps to focus on bugs and tweaks [as opposed to "How can I get Arabic-script working"], is a Good Idea (TM) etc :-) Best wishes Idris -- Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief International Journal of Shīʿī Studies Department of Philosophy Colorado State University Fort Collins, CO 80523

On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 02:48:13 -0700, luigi scarso wrote:

2010/11/30 Idris Samawi Hamid ادريس سماوي حامد :

...

What we need is for new users to be able to say, eg,

\setmainlanguage[arabic] \setupdirections[bidi=global] % maybe this should be implied by \setmainlanguage[arabic]

\starttext أهلا بالعالم! \stoptext

And get Scheharezade without doing anything else. Maybe we can put the fonts as an extra module .

Why a seperate module? It's an Open Font License. Why add unnecessary extra work for users, especially new ones? Best wishes Idris -- Professor Idris Samawi Hamid, Editor-in-Chief International Journal of Shiʿi Studies Department of Philosophy Colorado State University Fort Collins, CO 80523