I did want to typeset material within framedtext with some white before and after each line. Appropriate for this seems to me: \null\quad material \quad\null\crlf etc.; the preceding \null preventing disappearence of the first \quad. The strange thing is that the \null in the first line induces an extra vertical whitespace between the top of the frame and the first line inside the frame. An impression of the result: ----------------------- | | with \null in first line | first line | | second line | ----------------------- ----------------------- | first line | without \null in first line | second line | ----------------------- It seems counterintuitive to withhold the \null in the first line in order to have the framing correct. A minimal example on which I encountered this follows: \setupbodyfont[cmr] % gives extra vertical white \startframedtext[middle][width=fit] \null\quad\type{extra vertical space}\quad\null\crlf \null\quad\type{normal vertical space}\quad\null \stopframedtext % normal vertical white \startframedtext[middle][width=fit] \quad\type{normal vertical space}\quad\null\crlf \null\quad\type{normal vertical space}\quad\null \stopframedtext \stoptext Does this occur elsewhere too? Is it normal behaviour of framedtext? Hans van der Meer