missing stubs in latest release

older
Re: [dev-context] [NTG-context]...

Norbert Preining

14 Aug 2007 14 Aug '07

7:34 a.m.

Hi Hans! I am packaging up the latest context release for Debian, and have some questions before releasing it: - luatools and mtxtools is missing from scripts/context/unix/stubs, is this by intention or by error? - the debian packages ship additional stubs for: pdftrimwhite texfind texshow which are missing in the above dir, should/could/would you add them? - besides an additional Recommends: luatex do you think that other changes to packaging is necessary? (Not that you have to know the internals, this is only a question about some major incompatibilities I didn't find on the Wiki...) - does it make sense to package it now or wait for some more iterations? Thanks a lot and all the best Norbert ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Norbert Preining Vienna University of Technology Debian Developer Debian TeX Group gpg DSA: 0x09C5B094 fp: 14DF 2E6C 0307 BE6D AD76 A9C0 D2BF 4AA3 09C5 B094 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- HUTLERBURN (n.archaic) A burn sustained as a result of the behaviour of a clumsy hutler. (The precise duties of hutlers are now lost in the mists of history.) --- Douglas Adams, The Meaning of Liff

Show replies by date

Hans Hagen

14 Aug 14 Aug

9:37 a.m.

Norbert Preining wrote:

...

Hi Hans!

I am packaging up the latest context release for Debian, and have some questions before releasing it: - luatools and mtxtools is missing from scripts/context/unix/stubs, is this by intention or by error?

the problem is that some want stubs, some want symlinks ... if you like stubs more (my preference btw), then send me the ones as you like them and i will include them

...

- the debian packages ship additional stubs for: pdftrimwhite texfind texshow which are missing in the above dir, should/could/would you add them?

no real reason, texfind/texshow depend on tk as well, and pdftrimwhite is for karl (uses it for tugboat) and he know how to call it

...

- besides an additional Recommends: luatex do you think that other changes to packaging is necessary? (Not that you have to know the internals, this is only a question about some major incompatibilities I didn't find on the Wiki...)

if texlua and texluac are available then no lua is needed; mkiv needs lm opentype and texgyre opentype (used as defaults) so maybe make sure that texgyre is installed the biggest thing is the cache dir but the defaults should ok; if luatools --verbose --generate luatools --verbose --make --compile cont-en works ok, then things should be ok; btw, luatools --make --compile plain should also work and gives a plain that can read from zip files and such (later i will add open type font support)

...

- does it make sense to package it now or wait for some more iterations?

well, we need to start sometime i guess and since your work is the base for texlive best get things sorted out asap thanks, Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Norbert Preining

10:42 a.m.

On Die, 14 Aug 2007, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

stubs more (my preference btw), then send me the ones as you like them and i will include them

Will do.

...

if texlua and texluac are available then no lua is needed; mkiv needs lm

texluac?? texlua I know, what is texluac, also a link to luatex?

...

opentype and texgyre opentype (used as defaults) so maybe make sure that texgyre is installed

Ok, will check. Thanks a lot. Best wishes Norbert ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Norbert Preining Vienna University of Technology Debian Developer Debian TeX Group gpg DSA: 0x09C5B094 fp: 14DF 2E6C 0307 BE6D AD76 A9C0 D2BF 4AA3 09C5 B094 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- YEPPOON (n.) One of the hat-hanging corks which Australians wear for making Qantas commercials. --- Douglas Adams, The Meaning of Liff

Hans Hagen

10:46 a.m.

Norbert Preining wrote:

...

texluac?? texlua I know, what is texluac, also a link to luatex?

indeed, it acts as luac, the lua bytecode compiled ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Norbert Preining

11:53 a.m.

Hi Hans, On Die, 14 Aug 2007, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

opentype and texgyre opentype (used as defaults) so maybe make sure that texgyre is installed

another question: so *PER DEFAULT* you need Opentype TeX Gyre fonts? If yes, then this is a real problem, from the texlive tpm2deb.cfg file: # GYRE fonts have a very strange license ... blacklist;tpm;tex-gyre;* yes, they are blacklisted for now. I don't want to restart a discussion here, I guess you have heard about this already. Furthermore, I am not sure whether the tex-gyre fonts as shipped in TeX Live also contain the OpenType version. So we have 2 options for Debian: - package the tex-gyre fonts independently, and see whether it passes ftp-masters. I am not sure about that due to the licensing wishywashy. After this make context available. or - make context use the lmodern fonts Isn't there any chance that by default context uses the lmodern fonts? They are wide spread, packaged, easily available, stable. Is there a reason why you switches from the lm fonts (to which you have switched also recently) to the gyre ones? Best wishes Norbert ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Norbert Preining Vienna University of Technology Debian Developer Debian TeX Group gpg DSA: 0x09C5B094 fp: 14DF 2E6C 0307 BE6D AD76 A9C0 D2BF 4AA3 09C5 B094 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- EPSOM (n.) An entry in a diary (such as a date or a set of initials) or a name and address in your address book, which you haven't the faintest idea what it's doing there. --- Douglas Adams, The Meaning of Liff

Hans Hagen

12:37 p.m.

Norbert Preining wrote:

...

Isn't there any chance that by default context uses the lmodern fonts? They are wide spread, packaged, easily available, stable.

they do, what i meant was that when users swhitch to say palatino, then pagella is expected and not whatever-it's-called-in-berry-speak so why not make tex gyre a non free package, i'm sure no one bothers -) Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Norbert Preining

1:57 p.m.

On Die, 14 Aug 2007, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

...
Isn't there any chance that by default context uses the lmodern fonts? They are wide spread, packaged, easily available, stable.

they do, what i meant was that when users swhitch to say palatino, then pagella is expected and not whatever-it's-called-in-berry-speak

Ahhh, that is good. Perfect. Thanks for the clearing this misunderstanding.

...

so why not make tex gyre a non free package, i'm sure no one bothers -)

Well, the problem currently is that some of us (not necessary me) consider the licensing not a "non-free", but a "not-licensing" because it violates the rights of urw++... anyway, time will show ... Again, thanks, I hope that I can upload a package next week. Norbert ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Norbert Preining Vienna University of Technology Debian Developer Debian TeX Group gpg DSA: 0x09C5B094 fp: 14DF 2E6C 0307 BE6D AD76 A9C0 D2BF 4AA3 09C5 B094 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- UPOTTERY (n.) That part of a kitchen cupboard which contains an unnecessarily large number of milk jugs. --- Douglas Adams, The Meaning of Liff

Martin Schröder

2:01 p.m.

2007/8/14, Norbert Preining :

...

Well, the problem currently is that some of us (not necessary me) consider the licensing not a "non-free", but a "not-licensing" because it violates the rights of urw++... anyway, time will show ...

Has anyone bothered to ask urw++? Best Martin

Norbert Preining

2:07 p.m.

Hi Martin! On Die, 14 Aug 2007, Martin Schröder wrote:

...

...
consider the licensing not a "non-free", but a "not-licensing" because it violates the rights of urw++... anyway, time will show ...

Has anyone bothered to ask urw++?

I said that I don't want to start this here, but as you asked: urw++ released the fonts under gplv2. I agree that this is not the best (to be polite) license for fonts, but they did, and that was nice. but well, the gyre fonts are under the gust font license, which creates the following problem: are the gyre fonts derived work or not? If yes, they must be gpl, too. I know that urw++ will probably NOT go to court for this anyway, but still there is a problem. If someone has a good contact to urw++ and could ask them to relicense/double-license the fonts to gust fl or gpl/gfl, that would be fantastic ... but who could it be??? The problem is that neither the original authors of the GYre fonts nor the representatives of the user groups see this problem as a problem ... Best wishes Norbert ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Norbert Preining Vienna University of Technology Debian Developer Debian TeX Group gpg DSA: 0x09C5B094 fp: 14DF 2E6C 0307 BE6D AD76 A9C0 D2BF 4AA3 09C5 B094 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WHAPLODE DROVE (n.) A homicidal golf stroke. --- Douglas Adams, The Meaning of Liff

Martin Schröder

3:18 p.m.

2007/8/14, Norbert Preining :

...

but well, the gyre fonts are under the gust font license, which creates the following problem: are the gyre fonts derived work or not? If yes, they must be gpl, too.

We've both seen the presentation by the Gyre guys @ EuroBachoTeX2007: It's derived, but wastly improved, so it probably passes the threshold of originality. Still, one should ask urw++. Or we get a ruling by the FSF that the GUST licenses is GPL compatible (which is unlikely). Best Martin

Hans Hagen

3:46 p.m.

Martin Schröder wrote:

...

2007/8/14, Norbert Preining :

...
but well, the gyre fonts are under the gust font license, which creates the following problem: are the gyre fonts derived work or not? If yes, they must be gpl, too.

We've both seen the presentation by the Gyre guys @ EuroBachoTeX2007: It's derived, but wastly improved, so it probably passes the threshold of originality. Still, one should ask urw++. Or we get a ruling by the FSF that the GUST licenses is GPL compatible (which is unlikely).

well, i expect a new licence war soon anyway (the gpl 3 stuff) -) Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Hans Hagen

3:17 p.m.

Norbert Preining wrote:

...

Well, the problem currently is that some of us (not necessary me) consider the licensing not a "non-free", but a "not-licensing" because it violates the rights of urw++... anyway, time will show ...

indeed; btw, i think they wanted to contact urw so ... Hans ----------------------------------------------------------------- Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | fax: 038 477 53 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl -----------------------------------------------------------------

Norbert Preining

2:18 p.m.

Hi Hans, On Die, 14 Aug 2007, Hans Hagen wrote:

...

the problem is that some want stubs, some want symlinks ... if you like stubs more (my preference btw), then send me the ones as you like them and i will include them

Great, attached they are. mtxtools and luatools are taken from the context in april, the others I have written, texmfstart needed a stub but I never saw it included anywhere.

...

no real reason, texfind/texshow depend on tk as well, and pdftrimwhite is for karl (uses it for tugboat) and he know how to call it

and for me, it is useful ;-) Best wishes Norbert ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dr. Norbert Preining Vienna University of Technology Debian Developer Debian TeX Group gpg DSA: 0x09C5B094 fp: 14DF 2E6C 0307 BE6D AD76 A9C0 D2BF 4AA3 09C5 B094 ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CHENIES (pl.n.) The last few sprigs or tassels of last Christmas's decoration you notice on the ceiling while lying on the sofa on an August afternoon. --- Douglas Adams, The Meaning of Liff

6340

Age (days ago)

6340

Last active (days ago)

List overview

Download

12 comments

3 participants

participants (3)

Hans Hagen
Martin Schröder
Norbert Preining